"Do you agree that it doesn't matter how old they get, they're still just little boys all their lives?"

Surprisingly, even when confronted with such questions as these, the top of Teresa the Outspoken's head did not come off.

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When her kids were growing up, she let them watch only 30 minutes of TV a day -- "Wild Kingdom" or "Mister Rogers' Neighborhood." Once a week they were allowed to watch one hour more, but they had to write a one-paragraph report on why they liked that program.

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On the other hand, we came away from the whole experience a little worried about Dr. Phil's marriage. Dr. Phil, there are eight traits to a marriage in trouble. You have four of them; Henry VIII and Anne Boleyn had six.

Take, for example, when Dr. Phil was asked by Heinz Kerry how old his two boys were.

"Twenty-four and 17," Dr. Phil responded quickly.

"Twenty-five," Mrs. Dr. Phil said, as if she meant it to hurt. "He turned 25 last Sunday."

"Oh, yeah, that's right," Dr. Phil said, somewhat sheepishly.

"Twenty-five," Mrs. Dr. Phil said for good measure.

"I need to correct myself," he said contritely to the Kerrys, while his eyes screamed, "Help me, please!"

Later, when Mrs. Dr. Phil asked the Democratic nominee for president of the United States whether one of his two daughters was more like him, Kerry -- not realizing that this was just one of her setups to give the Dr. Phils an opportunity to talk about themselves -- answered diplomatically that daughter Alexandra is more like him in some ways but, in other ways, daughter Vanessa is more like him.

". . . because we have one son that I call Dr. Phil Jr.," Mrs. Dr. Phil prattled on happily. "He is so much like his father. But of course both our boys have a lot of their father's traits. But Jordan is just Phil McGraw Jr.!"

"Yeah, that's true," Dr. Phil chimed in. "But you're just bragging on him now."

Then, remembering that he was in the doghouse, Dr. Phil looked down and said, "Well, maybe not."

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"Did you ever hope you would have a daughter?" Mrs. Dr. Phil asked Heinz Kerry.

"Yes, I lost a couple -- I had some miscarriages."

"Oh," said Mrs. Dr. Phil, momentarily surprised to find her foot in her mouth.

"I have several pinkies in heaven. I call them pinkies," Heinz Kerry explained.